![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
lb_leeRogan: I am making the terrible mistake of staying up late, reading the False Memory Syndrome Foundation's "Summary of Legal Survey Data from the False Memory Syndrome Foundation: presented FMSF Conference Memory and Reality: Emerging Crisis" from April 17, 1993, so Y'ALL ARE COMING WITH ME.
"One in sixteen of the persons in contact with the FMS Foundation is, or has been, in the courts because of the [child abuse] accusations." (Abstract) Wow. I truly didn't expect them to just... flat-out admit that right out the gate. Nor did I expect the whole, "14% (60/432) of the accusations are being made by more than one family member (e.g., a daughter and then a grandchild, two cousins, etc.)" (3)
Mori: Aw, they have a little pie chart! And gosh, what a shock, "nearly three-fourths (293/432) [cases] are accused by a daughter against her parents"! FEMINISM: HAS IT GONE TOO FAR?!
"Ritual abuse (RA) is often used to describe events which include any or all of the following: ritualized rape or impregnation, ritualized torture, ritualized abortion, sacrificial murder, cannivalism, drinking of blood, forced use of mind altering drugs, multiple perpetrators, intergenerational perpetrators, perpetrators wearing disguistes and/or ceremonial robes and, in the case of satanic ritual abuse (SRA), the use of satanic symbols or satanic worship." (3)
Mori: Sooooo, by this definition, integenerational incest is RA. Getting assaulted by a Catholic priest in his workclothes is RA. Roofying someone is RA.
Rogan: I mean, that sums up my issue with the term, yes. Ritual abuse means whatever the fuckers want it to mean.
"The FMS Foundation Family Survey"
(Mori: Which I would shank a baby to get my hands on, by the way.)
"results indicate that 21% of the accusations based on 'repressed memories' include claims of ritualized abuse." (4)
Mori: No way! You mean a group of people that are mostly parents being accused by their daughters are RA when you define RA as including integenerational incest? I am shocked! SHOCKED!
"Most families hold out some hope of reconciliation and do not consider going to court or taking formal action against an accuser because they feel it may jeopardize a future reconciliation." (4)
Rogan: Someone should tell Pamela Freyd (the FMSF founder) and Herman Ohme (FMSF's "Chief Lawmaker in the Texas Senate") that!
"The most dramatic toll on families queried by the Legal Survey is lost of contact with children and grandchildren,"
Rogan: You don't say.
"loss of consort by non-accused husbands of wives who are developing images of parental child abuse"
Mori: the fuckzat even mean? I seriously can't parse that clause there.
Rogan: ...I want to say it means women dealing with memories of being abused don't want to fuck their husbands, but that sounds so over-the-top evil that even I can't believe the FMSF would say it. (EDIT: that's exactly what it means, and they did indeed say it.)
"loss of privacy, injury to reputation, increased health problems and marital stress." (4)
Mori: ...what, no job loss? No homelessness? No disability? WEAKSAUCE.
Rogan: When my roomy decided *I* was a child molester, I ended up couch-surfing within a couple months! And these guys are upset their kids won't talk to them? What candyland do they live in?
"In many cases the financial toll is substantial as well: legal fees, medical and therapy costs, insurance costs for therapy and/or hospitalization, possible award in a civil action, lost wages and lost jobs because of public yet unsubstantiated accusations." (4)
Mori: it took them THAT LONG to mention job loss? It's at the bottom of the list!
Rogan: Also, I want to point out, Freyd and Ohme initiated shit all by themselves. They spent that money. Their victims just wanted to be left alone. So that whole "financial toll" can be extremely misleading.
"There is a very real threat of having minor children removed from the home before facts are established." (4)
Rogan: wait. There's a THREAT? There's 432 cases. And yet... they offer no numbers for this. Has it... has it actually HAPPENED?
"Fot over half of the affected persons in contact with the FMS Foundation, civil lawsuits are a serious concern"
Rogan: I'll bet they are! Our family was worried about them too!
"and for about one-sixth (475/3050) lawsuits have already been filed or formally threatened." (4-5)
Mori: Just so you know, on page 1 they explain in a footnote that "For purposes of the FMSF Legal Survey, a 'formal' threat is one in which a specific statement, written or oral, indicates that the accuser is contemplating filing a suit." Not that they're actually going to MAKE one or threaten one. Just that they're THINKING about it.
Rogan: Also, note that the lawuits weren't necessarily filed BY THE VICTIM/ACCUSER. In the footnote down at the bottom of the page, we have this winner:
"The 192 cases include: 177 members who have been sued on the basis of repressed memories, or who have sued the therapist, clinic, or the accuser."
Mori: HOW MANY OF WHICH, GUYS? That's a real important distinction! There's a big difference between, "oh noes, my daughter accused me of abusing her and dragged me to court," and "my daughter accused me of abusing her and I dragged HER to court!" Especially if you want to play poor financially tormented victim! You can't claim that you're a victim of financial loss IF YOU WERE THE ONE MAKING THE LAWSUIT IN THE FIRST PLACE.
And they never explain! There are some truly hideous bar graphs on page 6, entitled "Actions Against and By The Accused," but there's a HUGE difference between those two! There's no difference between defense and offense here! It's real fucking suspicious, guys!
"It must be noted that many members of the FMS Foundation are involved in several types of action (e.g., a suit filed against the member who has responded with a counter-claim, both a restraining order and a suit may have been brought, etc.) The total number of actions tracked therefore, exceeds the number of persons whose case [sic] has been included in the FMSF Legal Survey."
Rogan: You don't say.
"The FMSF Legal Survey has documented 199 cases where a formal threat of legal action has been made on the basis of 'repressed memory' of child abuse. 41 of these cases, or nearly one-fifth of those threatened, recived a letter demanding money to forestall a lawsuit." (7)
Mori: Holy shit, that sounds like serious blackmail! That--
"The letters typically demand money for therapy, lost work time, and/or future therapy." (7)
Mori: Oh wait, never mind.
"Other threats are related to grandparents [sic] efforst to contact their grandchildren or to obtain visitation rights to see them. Accused parents have been told, 'If you try to see the grandchildren, I will sue'."
Mori: I mean, yes, if you raped the parents of your grandchildren, they might not want to let you hang out with them.
Rogan: Unless you're from our family, of course.
Mori: Oh yes, dear ol' Grampa was the center of all the Christmas parties! All he wants for Christmas is you!
"Three police investigations included escavations of the accused parents' basement and back yard in a search for evidence or human remains. FMSF has not learned of any evidence being found in any of those investigations to support the claims." (7)
Rogan: That doesn't surprise me.
"Following complaints filed by an adult with 'repressed memories', some families with minor children living at home have been investigated by local child protective agencies." (7)
Mori: Give me a number, assholes. You give them everywhere else, which makes me REAL suspicious when you suddenly just say "some." You were willing to say how many of you fuckers got your lawn dug up for corpses, but you won't say how many were investigated by CPS?
"In a number of cases, memories of abuse did not exist prior to a session in which hypnosis or sodium amytal were used." (9)
Mori: An unstated number!
Rogan: Also, you shouldn't fucking do either. I only know of sodium amytal being used in the whole Sybil thing; I saw hypnosis break someone and David Yeung has a warning about it. Lest you forget, abusive therapists totally exist and were involved in this whole thing. Just the FMSF don't show much sign for caring for the patients' actual well-being, except as a beating club.
"In one case parents have been charged with 10 sexual offenses by all three children." (12)
Mori: SO SUSPICIOUS. Some of these cases, who knows, but this one? What kind of parents get accused of abuse by ALL their kids?
"Nearly half of the criminal suits included in the FMSF Legal Survey ended in a conviction. (Footnote: Sentences range from 21 months to life imprisonment." (12)
Rogan: And yet, this is the group who in their first, paper-only newsletter, have under a section entitled "HOW DO WE KNOW WE ARE NOT REPRESENTING PEDOPHILES?" the response, "We are a good looking bunch of people: graying hair, well-dressed, healthy, smiling. [...] Just about every person [...] is someone you would likely find interesting and want to count as a friend." Also maybe they'll be willing to do polygraph tests to prove it.
Mori: Would a respectable group of rich white people like us end up in jail for life for good reason? Nah!
"There were 17 criminal convictions. [...] The accused family members who pled guilty to a lesser charge"
Mori: Wait, wait, wait, these people pled guilty and you STILL insist every one of them is innocent because respectability? HOW MANY OF THEM WERE THERE?
"reported that they were in poor health, and that their doctors felt they might not survive a lengthy crtiminal trial." (12)
Rogan: Not like us accusers. We're like fucking polar bears.
"In all interviews with respondents to the FMSF Legal Surveywho have been convicted or with members of their immediate families, the accused continue to maintain their innocence." (13)
Rogan: They just pled guilty because they were just such frail delicate flowers at the mercy of their wicked children.
Mori: OH SHIT FINALLY A SECTION CALLED "Actions by the Accused"! Will I finally get to know how many of these suits were initated by FMSF members or the people accusing them of abuse?
"Before describing the actions initiated by persons in contact with the FMS Foundation, it is to be noted that these persons often report that they had not wanted to take such a step because of their 'concern about further destruction ot family,' reluctance to put more 'stress on the grandchildren,' fears that they may lose what opportunity they have to see the grandchildren..." (14)
Rogan: *clears throat, pulls up Ohme's newsletter from 2002* "I [...] wanted some personal revenge against my daughter's "Christian" Therapist so I camped out on the doorstep of the Chairman the Texas Mental Health Licensing Board with complaints and videos and articles....I threatened a lawsuit against the clinic where this RMT [Recovered Memory Therapy] therapists [sic] worked.
"After three months of non-stop complaints from me, the 'Christian' therapist lost her job and left Austin, left Texas, and returned to her home state of KY...I then registered the same complaints against her with the KY State Licensing Board so she could not poison KY patients.
"My vendetta against [my daughter's] therapist drove a wedge of hatred between my daughter and me . She wrote me the most hateful letter I've ever read but, even at that cost, I felt GREAT because I got some revenge and more important, I had learned how to lobby and win."
Mori: But back to the FMSF data.
"62 members of the FMS Foundation have told the Foundation that they have considered bringing a suit against the therapist and/or clinic which to the best of their knowledge is responsible for the development of false memories and the subsequent wrongful accusations. [...] The FMSF is aware of 13 suits by accused family members which are pending against therapists at this time. [...] An additional 14 persons report to the FMSF Legal Survey that they are preparing to sue the therapist. [...] 26 persons report to the FMSF Legal Survey that they have contacted an attorney about the possibility of initiating a suit against the person making accusations of sexual abuse on the basis of 'repressed memory'." "The FMS Foundation is aware of 12 suits which have been filed against accusers." (14)
Mori: Earlier, they mentioned that 192 people with the FMSF "is, or has been, in the courts because of these accusations." So, let's see, add all this up and we've got 127 cases of someone considering, planning, or suing kid or shrink. Rogan, how many lawsuits did the kids actually do?
Rogan: To my horror it is almost two in the morning and I am too groggy to make sense of any of those numbers up there.
"Some are considering legal remedy against an accuser who is making unsubstantiated public claims in the community, to the press or in published autobiographies." (15)
Rogan: Me. They're talking about people like me here, to be clear. By this understanding, this blog, AllFam, Red and Blue, EOZ, and Madgic are all published autobiographies. These people are talking about being accused of sexual abuse, mostly by their daughters, and their response is to sue them. They CLAIM it's because their poor darlings have been brainwashed by therapists... but they're suing accusers and shrinks equally here.
Mori: Also "unsubstantiated public claims in the community" could also mean "I talk to a neighbor or mutual friend about it and they squeal." So yeah, by the FMSF rules, remembering your dad raped you as a kid becomes "repressed memories" and "ritual abuse," asking for money to pay the therapy bills is "letters demanding money," and talking about it to a mutual contact who squeals becomes "making unsubstantiated public claims in the community," possibly justifying a lawsuit.
"In some cases, public statements have caused an accused parent to lose a job." (15)
Mori: HOW MANY?
Rogan: I, of course, have never lost a job due to my abuse history!
"Siblings feel the stress of the accusation has caused the health of the accused parent to deteriorate substantially." (15)
Rogan: As someone who's had to deal with being thought a child molester and having my book robo-banned as child porn, I can testify that it is indeed stressful. But you know what I have never considered doing? Suing itch.io or my old roommates, creating a lobby group to make legislation to punish them, or running them out of town.
"One in sixteen of the persons in contact with the FMS Foundation is, or has been, in the courts because of the [child abuse] accusations." (Abstract) Wow. I truly didn't expect them to just... flat-out admit that right out the gate. Nor did I expect the whole, "14% (60/432) of the accusations are being made by more than one family member (e.g., a daughter and then a grandchild, two cousins, etc.)" (3)
Mori: Aw, they have a little pie chart! And gosh, what a shock, "nearly three-fourths (293/432) [cases] are accused by a daughter against her parents"! FEMINISM: HAS IT GONE TOO FAR?!
"Ritual abuse (RA) is often used to describe events which include any or all of the following: ritualized rape or impregnation, ritualized torture, ritualized abortion, sacrificial murder, cannivalism, drinking of blood, forced use of mind altering drugs, multiple perpetrators, intergenerational perpetrators, perpetrators wearing disguistes and/or ceremonial robes and, in the case of satanic ritual abuse (SRA), the use of satanic symbols or satanic worship." (3)
Mori: Sooooo, by this definition, integenerational incest is RA. Getting assaulted by a Catholic priest in his workclothes is RA. Roofying someone is RA.
Rogan: I mean, that sums up my issue with the term, yes. Ritual abuse means whatever the fuckers want it to mean.
"The FMS Foundation Family Survey"
(Mori: Which I would shank a baby to get my hands on, by the way.)
"results indicate that 21% of the accusations based on 'repressed memories' include claims of ritualized abuse." (4)
Mori: No way! You mean a group of people that are mostly parents being accused by their daughters are RA when you define RA as including integenerational incest? I am shocked! SHOCKED!
"Most families hold out some hope of reconciliation and do not consider going to court or taking formal action against an accuser because they feel it may jeopardize a future reconciliation." (4)
Rogan: Someone should tell Pamela Freyd (the FMSF founder) and Herman Ohme (FMSF's "Chief Lawmaker in the Texas Senate") that!
"The most dramatic toll on families queried by the Legal Survey is lost of contact with children and grandchildren,"
Rogan: You don't say.
"loss of consort by non-accused husbands of wives who are developing images of parental child abuse"
Mori: the fuckzat even mean? I seriously can't parse that clause there.
Rogan: ...I want to say it means women dealing with memories of being abused don't want to fuck their husbands, but that sounds so over-the-top evil that even I can't believe the FMSF would say it. (EDIT: that's exactly what it means, and they did indeed say it.)
"loss of privacy, injury to reputation, increased health problems and marital stress." (4)
Mori: ...what, no job loss? No homelessness? No disability? WEAKSAUCE.
Rogan: When my roomy decided *I* was a child molester, I ended up couch-surfing within a couple months! And these guys are upset their kids won't talk to them? What candyland do they live in?
"In many cases the financial toll is substantial as well: legal fees, medical and therapy costs, insurance costs for therapy and/or hospitalization, possible award in a civil action, lost wages and lost jobs because of public yet unsubstantiated accusations." (4)
Mori: it took them THAT LONG to mention job loss? It's at the bottom of the list!
Rogan: Also, I want to point out, Freyd and Ohme initiated shit all by themselves. They spent that money. Their victims just wanted to be left alone. So that whole "financial toll" can be extremely misleading.
"There is a very real threat of having minor children removed from the home before facts are established." (4)
Rogan: wait. There's a THREAT? There's 432 cases. And yet... they offer no numbers for this. Has it... has it actually HAPPENED?
"Fot over half of the affected persons in contact with the FMS Foundation, civil lawsuits are a serious concern"
Rogan: I'll bet they are! Our family was worried about them too!
"and for about one-sixth (475/3050) lawsuits have already been filed or formally threatened." (4-5)
Mori: Just so you know, on page 1 they explain in a footnote that "For purposes of the FMSF Legal Survey, a 'formal' threat is one in which a specific statement, written or oral, indicates that the accuser is contemplating filing a suit." Not that they're actually going to MAKE one or threaten one. Just that they're THINKING about it.
Rogan: Also, note that the lawuits weren't necessarily filed BY THE VICTIM/ACCUSER. In the footnote down at the bottom of the page, we have this winner:
"The 192 cases include: 177 members who have been sued on the basis of repressed memories, or who have sued the therapist, clinic, or the accuser."
Mori: HOW MANY OF WHICH, GUYS? That's a real important distinction! There's a big difference between, "oh noes, my daughter accused me of abusing her and dragged me to court," and "my daughter accused me of abusing her and I dragged HER to court!" Especially if you want to play poor financially tormented victim! You can't claim that you're a victim of financial loss IF YOU WERE THE ONE MAKING THE LAWSUIT IN THE FIRST PLACE.
And they never explain! There are some truly hideous bar graphs on page 6, entitled "Actions Against and By The Accused," but there's a HUGE difference between those two! There's no difference between defense and offense here! It's real fucking suspicious, guys!
"It must be noted that many members of the FMS Foundation are involved in several types of action (e.g., a suit filed against the member who has responded with a counter-claim, both a restraining order and a suit may have been brought, etc.) The total number of actions tracked therefore, exceeds the number of persons whose case [sic] has been included in the FMSF Legal Survey."
Rogan: You don't say.
"The FMSF Legal Survey has documented 199 cases where a formal threat of legal action has been made on the basis of 'repressed memory' of child abuse. 41 of these cases, or nearly one-fifth of those threatened, recived a letter demanding money to forestall a lawsuit." (7)
Mori: Holy shit, that sounds like serious blackmail! That--
"The letters typically demand money for therapy, lost work time, and/or future therapy." (7)
Mori: Oh wait, never mind.
"Other threats are related to grandparents [sic] efforst to contact their grandchildren or to obtain visitation rights to see them. Accused parents have been told, 'If you try to see the grandchildren, I will sue'."
Mori: I mean, yes, if you raped the parents of your grandchildren, they might not want to let you hang out with them.
Rogan: Unless you're from our family, of course.
Mori: Oh yes, dear ol' Grampa was the center of all the Christmas parties! All he wants for Christmas is you!
"Three police investigations included escavations of the accused parents' basement and back yard in a search for evidence or human remains. FMSF has not learned of any evidence being found in any of those investigations to support the claims." (7)
Rogan: That doesn't surprise me.
"Following complaints filed by an adult with 'repressed memories', some families with minor children living at home have been investigated by local child protective agencies." (7)
Mori: Give me a number, assholes. You give them everywhere else, which makes me REAL suspicious when you suddenly just say "some." You were willing to say how many of you fuckers got your lawn dug up for corpses, but you won't say how many were investigated by CPS?
"In a number of cases, memories of abuse did not exist prior to a session in which hypnosis or sodium amytal were used." (9)
Mori: An unstated number!
Rogan: Also, you shouldn't fucking do either. I only know of sodium amytal being used in the whole Sybil thing; I saw hypnosis break someone and David Yeung has a warning about it. Lest you forget, abusive therapists totally exist and were involved in this whole thing. Just the FMSF don't show much sign for caring for the patients' actual well-being, except as a beating club.
"In one case parents have been charged with 10 sexual offenses by all three children." (12)
Mori: SO SUSPICIOUS. Some of these cases, who knows, but this one? What kind of parents get accused of abuse by ALL their kids?
"Nearly half of the criminal suits included in the FMSF Legal Survey ended in a conviction. (Footnote: Sentences range from 21 months to life imprisonment." (12)
Rogan: And yet, this is the group who in their first, paper-only newsletter, have under a section entitled "HOW DO WE KNOW WE ARE NOT REPRESENTING PEDOPHILES?" the response, "We are a good looking bunch of people: graying hair, well-dressed, healthy, smiling. [...] Just about every person [...] is someone you would likely find interesting and want to count as a friend." Also maybe they'll be willing to do polygraph tests to prove it.
Mori: Would a respectable group of rich white people like us end up in jail for life for good reason? Nah!
"There were 17 criminal convictions. [...] The accused family members who pled guilty to a lesser charge"
Mori: Wait, wait, wait, these people pled guilty and you STILL insist every one of them is innocent because respectability? HOW MANY OF THEM WERE THERE?
"reported that they were in poor health, and that their doctors felt they might not survive a lengthy crtiminal trial." (12)
Rogan: Not like us accusers. We're like fucking polar bears.
"In all interviews with respondents to the FMSF Legal Surveywho have been convicted or with members of their immediate families, the accused continue to maintain their innocence." (13)
Rogan: They just pled guilty because they were just such frail delicate flowers at the mercy of their wicked children.
Mori: OH SHIT FINALLY A SECTION CALLED "Actions by the Accused"! Will I finally get to know how many of these suits were initated by FMSF members or the people accusing them of abuse?
"Before describing the actions initiated by persons in contact with the FMS Foundation, it is to be noted that these persons often report that they had not wanted to take such a step because of their 'concern about further destruction ot family,' reluctance to put more 'stress on the grandchildren,' fears that they may lose what opportunity they have to see the grandchildren..." (14)
Rogan: *clears throat, pulls up Ohme's newsletter from 2002* "I [...] wanted some personal revenge against my daughter's "Christian" Therapist so I camped out on the doorstep of the Chairman the Texas Mental Health Licensing Board with complaints and videos and articles....I threatened a lawsuit against the clinic where this RMT [Recovered Memory Therapy] therapists [sic] worked.
"After three months of non-stop complaints from me, the 'Christian' therapist lost her job and left Austin, left Texas, and returned to her home state of KY...I then registered the same complaints against her with the KY State Licensing Board so she could not poison KY patients.
"My vendetta against [my daughter's] therapist drove a wedge of hatred between my daughter and me . She wrote me the most hateful letter I've ever read but, even at that cost, I felt GREAT because I got some revenge and more important, I had learned how to lobby and win."
Mori: But back to the FMSF data.
"62 members of the FMS Foundation have told the Foundation that they have considered bringing a suit against the therapist and/or clinic which to the best of their knowledge is responsible for the development of false memories and the subsequent wrongful accusations. [...] The FMSF is aware of 13 suits by accused family members which are pending against therapists at this time. [...] An additional 14 persons report to the FMSF Legal Survey that they are preparing to sue the therapist. [...] 26 persons report to the FMSF Legal Survey that they have contacted an attorney about the possibility of initiating a suit against the person making accusations of sexual abuse on the basis of 'repressed memory'." "The FMS Foundation is aware of 12 suits which have been filed against accusers." (14)
Mori: Earlier, they mentioned that 192 people with the FMSF "is, or has been, in the courts because of these accusations." So, let's see, add all this up and we've got 127 cases of someone considering, planning, or suing kid or shrink. Rogan, how many lawsuits did the kids actually do?
Rogan: To my horror it is almost two in the morning and I am too groggy to make sense of any of those numbers up there.
"Some are considering legal remedy against an accuser who is making unsubstantiated public claims in the community, to the press or in published autobiographies." (15)
Rogan: Me. They're talking about people like me here, to be clear. By this understanding, this blog, AllFam, Red and Blue, EOZ, and Madgic are all published autobiographies. These people are talking about being accused of sexual abuse, mostly by their daughters, and their response is to sue them. They CLAIM it's because their poor darlings have been brainwashed by therapists... but they're suing accusers and shrinks equally here.
Mori: Also "unsubstantiated public claims in the community" could also mean "I talk to a neighbor or mutual friend about it and they squeal." So yeah, by the FMSF rules, remembering your dad raped you as a kid becomes "repressed memories" and "ritual abuse," asking for money to pay the therapy bills is "letters demanding money," and talking about it to a mutual contact who squeals becomes "making unsubstantiated public claims in the community," possibly justifying a lawsuit.
"In some cases, public statements have caused an accused parent to lose a job." (15)
Mori: HOW MANY?
Rogan: I, of course, have never lost a job due to my abuse history!
"Siblings feel the stress of the accusation has caused the health of the accused parent to deteriorate substantially." (15)
Rogan: As someone who's had to deal with being thought a child molester and having my book robo-banned as child porn, I can testify that it is indeed stressful. But you know what I have never considered doing? Suing itch.io or my old roommates, creating a lobby group to make legislation to punish them, or running them out of town.
no subject
Date: 2025-09-20 07:35 am (UTC)I didn't realize they used that strategy with everything. "Ritual abuse" lets them use discredited claims like Michelle Remembers against accounts involving things that are known to happen, such as intergenerational perpetrators, multiple perpetrators, or assaults involving drugs. "Actions" lets them lump together people being targeted by legal actions based on accusations and people who go out of their way to sue their children and their children's therapists. It doesn't matter if the case is nothing like the "Vulnerable mentally ill person brainwashed by a therapist to make physically impossible claims about a Satanic cult, ruining their family's lives with demands for money and criminal charges" picture they're painting, they've redefined terms to put the case in the same category as that!
no subject
Date: 2025-09-20 08:25 am (UTC)I may get the sense that something is not right, but there's little chance that I will be able to articulate why.
You folks? You can say _why_ it's bullshit. With citations, even.
no subject
Date: 2025-09-20 09:30 am (UTC)Worth pointing out that these people are reactionaties who grew up in a time when marital rape wasn't even named, let alone recognized as immoral or illegal. According to Wikipedia, it only started being made illegal in the 1970s. I assume the FMSF straight up didn't think it was a thing. Hell, plenty of conservatives nowadays - especially Christians - think a woman is obligated to comply with her husband's sexual demands, regardless of what she herself wants. It's a bleak reality we live in.
no subject
Date: 2025-09-20 03:30 pm (UTC)Also, I am so sorry about that creep therapist you had. It’s so frustrating because therapist or medical abuse is a real thing! It’s not hard to find SUPER sketchy things! But these people overwhelmingly only seemed to care about using that as a beating stick.
no subject
Date: 2025-09-20 03:44 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2025-09-20 03:47 pm (UTC)Them: my abused wife won’t fuck me. :(
no subject
Date: 2025-09-20 06:44 pm (UTC)anyways about what I expected from this clown circus but that's an insult to clowns.
no subject
Date: 2025-09-20 07:27 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2025-09-20 08:26 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2025-09-23 12:01 am (UTC)Yeah we weren't really around for this thankfully, but it still triggers the good ol' fear response that comes with wanting to address literally anything wrong or even something mundane that could cause conflict. All those guides that tell you 'just be assertive! it's worth it to speak up! conflict isn't that bad!' don't mean jack shit to me when brain comes out swinging with 'yeah but the other person could turn around and make your life a living hell for daring to speak up.' and then cases like this just prove that fear right. People absolutely can and will go to absurd lengths for revenge especially if they are the cause of the wrong!
Mad respect for anyone who stands up to the bullshit anyway, consequences be damned. True heroes.
no subject
Date: 2025-09-23 12:13 pm (UTC)The sodium amytyl stuff is way, way, WAY worse than just the Sybil stuff. We know of a system who was digitizing a bunch of these quack therapists' records in grad school a few years back, and it's honestly kind of horrific tbh. I know they have a Discord, gotta see what made it to the socials. If I find anything, I'll send it your way!
no subject
Date: 2025-09-23 10:49 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2025-09-26 01:16 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2025-09-26 03:05 pm (UTC)